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America, what's the crack with cups
Neil Walker
Member #210
April 2000
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Hello,
Do you still do weights and measures using cups?

I'm looking around websites for recipes and they're talking about cups. So I go off and find out what a cup is. Turns out that a cup isn't actually a weighted measure, it's a literal cup! wtf! a cup of sugar is a different weight to a cup of butter. Does nobody use scales or any kind of weights ;)

I'd use the word backward, but I still work in inches, feet and ounces so I can't really say much.

Wouldn't it be much easier to say 100grams (or 4oz, whatever), rather than looking down a long list of items to figure out how much I need?

Neil.
MAME Cabinet Blog / AXL LIBRARY (a games framework) / AXL Documentation and Tutorial

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Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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Your average cook has cups, but not scales to weigh things. A cup is 8 fl. oz. (water, I suppose), two cups is a pint, two pints is a quart, yadda yadda yadda.

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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alethiophile
Member #9,349
December 2007
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Volume, not weight.

--
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Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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How do you know how much 250 mL or 1 cup or 100 pounds or 10000 kgs is unless you measure it somehow? :P

weapon_S
Member #7,859
October 2006
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Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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He's probably pouring flour onto his bathroom scale ... "It sure would be easier if they listed the weight in stones."

Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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Probably he's using his kitchen scales and is used to the sort of cookbooks available here, which don't use cups or anything similar? Even olde Imperial units differ between America and Britain — stuff like the cup doesn't exist here just as you don't often talk about stone in America, and units like the pint are different (approximately 568ml here, only 473ml to an American). Until I read this thread I had no idea that a cup was an exact divisor of a pint in America and had someone instructed me to go to an American supermarket to source, say, eleven cups of milk, I'd have had no idea how to figure out how much to buy other than pure volume estimation.

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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I see the Wikipedia picture of a cup is the type for measuring liquid. The liquid cup has the 1 cup measure below the rim so you can fill it with liquid without spilling, whereas the dry measure cup has the 1 cup gradiation exactly at the rim so you can drag a straightedge across it to clear the excess. I used to be a cook, too 8-)

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

Neil Walker
Member #210
April 2000
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It's actually for a diet for somebody. It is equating portion sizes to cups, so one portion is a cup of lettuce, but only half a cup of chopped vegetables and a quarter of a cup of dried fruit.

Going by that, how squashed do they want me to make the lettuce, how finely chopped are my vegetables? ;)

Then you get onto the issue of just how big is a cup, are they all the same? If so, why can't they adopt sensible values, e.g. how are you going to measure accurately 7/16ths of a cup? when 125ml would be far easier (and in the case of milli-litres you can use weighing scales rather than checking lines on a cup).

All I'm getting at, is if they said 100g of vegetables it's exact and there's no need to do anything else other than measure it, rather than spend a page describing what a cup of everything is.

Neil.
MAME Cabinet Blog / AXL LIBRARY (a games framework) / AXL Documentation and Tutorial

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Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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Then you get onto the issue of just how big is a cup, are they all the same? If so, why can't they adopt sensible values, e.g. how are you going to measure accurately 7/16ths of a cup? when 125ml would be far easier (and in the case of milli-litres you can use weighing scales rather than checking lines on a cup).

A cup is a measure of volume. They are all the same size*. 1 cup of lettuce is the same volume as 1 cup of vegetables, just like 1 gram of lettuce is the same weight as 1 gram of vegetables.

Most of the measuring cups I've seen also have milli-litres marked on them, if you prefer that measurement.

I'm slightly confused here, how would you go about measuring milli-litres (a unit of volume) on a weighing scale (which, as the name implies, measures weight)?

* Although there are people who, like my grandmother once did, will grab a normal cup out of the cupboard and use it as a measuring cup. This produces sub-optimal results.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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The measuring cup is a standard size. It needs no description. There's no need to look up anything if you own a measuring cup.

how squashed do they want me to make the lettuce, how finely chopped are my vegetables?
e.g. how are you going to measure accurately 7/16ths of a cup?

It's not an exact science here. You might as well start complaining about stuff like "How do I know if your vegetables are of the same quality as the ones in the recipe?" Just chop them up as you see fit until you have almost half (7/16) of a cup.

Evert
Member #794
November 2000
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Hmm... when I make rice or macaroni I usually measure quantities in cups or mugs, usually of the type you serve tea in. I had no idea there's an actual measurement of that name.
I am used to recipes calling for "tablespoons", "teaspoons", "knifepoints" or "pinches" of something or other, which I know actually correspond to well-defined amounts, but I usually just take something that looks about right. Cooking is more an art than a science anyway.

It is equating portion sizes to cups, so one portion is a cup of lettuce, but only half a cup of chopped vegetables and a quarter of a cup of dried fruit.

That sounds like a very tiny portion to me, but then again, the serving size of vegetables in North America seems to be half or less of what I'm used to, so that may also make a difference (serving size of meat is more than a factor of two larger).
"Cup of lettuce" sounds funny though. ;)

EDIT

I'm slightly confused here, how would you go about measuring milli-litres (a unit of volume) on a weighing scale (which, as the name implies, measures weight)?

One litre of water weighs one kilogram; assuming most food items have roughly the same density as water (how good or bad this is depends on the item, obviously) or assuming you otherwise know the density (I wouldn't, but hey) you can use a scale to measure volume.
That said, most recipes I've ever used state weight (rather than volume) of things like vegetables and meat and volumes of things you can actually pour (liquids and flour, mostly).

Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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Evert said:

That said, most recipes I've ever used state weight (rather than volume) of things like vegetables and meat and volumes of things you can actually pour (liquids and flour, mostly).

Yes, that makes sense. But he said that he could measure the volume of items with a scale. So unless he has memorized the densities of various foods I don't see how he could do that.

BAF
Member #2,981
December 2002
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Ah, you're following a recipe for salad? I just toss a bunch of veggies and whatever in until it looks like something I want to eat, and I eat it. :-/

As far as "one cup of lettuce" they're prolly talking about chopped lettuce or something. Personally, I'd just throw some on.

Thomas Harte
Member #33
April 2000
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so you can drag a straightedge across it to clear the excess

Incidentally, how common are straighedges, which I understand to be like rulers but without units on them? It was something none of us that worked on a US math [sic] textbook had heard of in advance, but straightedge and compass constructions seem to be considered much more important in the Californian educational standards than they are in the UK curriculum (where I guess they'd be taught as ruler and compasses, sort of muddling through the point that you're explicitly not using the straight-edged implement to measure distances).

Neil Walker
Member #210
April 2000
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Evert said:

That sounds like a very tiny portion to me

Yes, it's for a catabolic diet. Basically you eat nothing but catabolic foods (theory is you burn more calories eating than you get from it), with some supplements of white fish or meat for the protein. No carbs whatsoever. You can't even eat more lettuce if you wanted to ;)

It's best to stick to one week only, and most people lose in excess of 1lb a day. They say it attacks the long term stored fat as well rather than the easy stuff your body normally burns.

That's the theory and what I've read. My mate and his girlfriend tried it. They both lost about 9lb in a week and say after the first dodgy day they woke up much more refreshed and alert during the diet.

Yes, that makes sense. But he said that he could measure the volume of items with a scale

I was just referring to water type liquids. Sorry for the confusion.

btw, I'm not fat - it's for somebody else - my body is a temple 8-)

Neil.
MAME Cabinet Blog / AXL LIBRARY (a games framework) / AXL Documentation and Tutorial

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Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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btw, I'm not fat - it's for somebody else - my body is a temple

I am. I need to lose about 30 pounds to be at the upper end of the "ideal body weight for my height" chart. And since the accuracy of those charts is questionable (after all, they're just random web pages), I could probably stand to lose 40 pounds.

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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Incidentally, how common are straighedges, which I understand to be like rulers but without units on them?

I didn't mean an ANSI approved straightedge, but rather the edge of a reasonably straight spatula or something.

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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Incidentally, how common are straighedges, which I understand to be like rulers but without units on them?

Most normal people would just use the back of a knife or something with a straight edge. ;) IIRC, in high school, straight-edge was just a synonym for ruler when used outside the context of measuring distance... :-/ It's not like we'd purposely buy a separate tool for each. ::)

WHOA, what are you doing?!
I'm checking the straightness of this edge...
With a RULER?! Are you mad!
But...
You're going to break it! Go get the straight-edge...!

;D

Evert
Member #794
November 2000
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(theory is you burn more calories eating than you get from it)

Eating cucumbers will do that too. So would eating lettuce, I would have thought.

Quote:

It's best to stick to one week only, and most people lose in excess of 1lb a day. They say it attacks the long term stored fat as well rather than the easy stuff your body normally burns.

Hmm. Ok, so you lose weight quickly. How long after you quit the diet until it's back?
Losing weight is relatively easy, but the tricky part[1] is to stay at a healthy weight. That probably requires a structural change in life style.

References

  1. Apparently, I don't have any personal experience
Neil Black
Member #7,867
October 2006
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At my school, using a ruler as a straight-edge was considered to be almost as bad as using a #3 pencil on a scantron.

EDIT:

Evert said:

Losing weight is relatively easy, but the tricky part[1] is to stay at a healthy weight. That probably requires a structural change in life style.

Yup, that's why I've changed my diet and started exercising more.

Arthur Kalliokoski
Second in Command
February 2005
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Eating any high cellulose vegetable should have the effect of not causing you to gain weight according to calories, because cellulose burns (in the calorimeter), but isn't digestable (unless you're a cow).

They all watch too much MSNBC... they get ideas.

HardTranceFan
Member #7,317
June 2006
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Down here we use cups when cooking. Maybe it's an American influence, but I always considered it a standard unit of measure in baking.

The only thing I don;t understand is a stick of butter. WTH is a stick of butter?

--
"Shame your mind don't shine like your possessions do" - Faithless (I want more part 1)

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
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As odd as it may seem, a stick of butter is ... a stick of butter:

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