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bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
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BSoD could also be the kernel's fault. Linux has the kernel panic, but you very rarely experienced it. For BSoD to be so widespread and for it to take so long before they worked it out it is definitely a sore spot for Windows. Of course, Vista was also well known for its BSoDs. So even though they did mostly work the kinks out of XP by the end, Vista and 8 pretty much brought it back again... So evidently it's not something that Microsoft has figured out yet. 10 is basically 8.2 so it's no wonder it was much more stable. Let's just see what the next major iteration does. :)

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

Fun fact: Windows drivers by 3rd parties were one of the most common sources of BSODs because they were written so poorly and could take down the kernel easily in earlier versions of windows. Only time I've ever seen a BSOD in 8/10 is hardware failure and over-temperature CPUs.

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
avatar

You'd think with Windows being the primary market for graphics cards and probably most other PC hardware that their vendors would want to ship quality drivers. And similarly, since the BSOD epidemic makes Windows look bad, you'd think Microsoft would be willing to work with vendors to fix their drivers ASAP. I suppose back in the day when the drivers were really unreliable the software development tools/practices were just poorer though. So it might have just been difficult to figure out the cause..

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

.

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

bamccaig said:

You'd think with Windows being the primary market for graphics cards and probably most other PC hardware that their vendors would want to ship quality drivers.

Drivers are software and the only "quality" software that gets shipped is from businesses who actually demand it internally. The world runs on insecure software. Every bank. Every credit card. Every school. Everything. I've seen public, ADMIN credentials, hosted on a PUBLIC URL for a school so Norton Ghost can download the partition for a new computer over the network. Bugs are just like security (and almost identical!).

Businesses don't get money for quality software, they get money for shipping software. The only time I've ever written good code professionally is when I demanded it from myself--and often it got me in trouble because the project always STARTED being developed after the first due date so I've got e-mails and phone calls hounding me when the next release will be... even before I've finished looked at old code or their database layout.

If you're making a piece of crap thing like, a mouse, an SD card reader, or something (and this was before Windows and USB had generic versions of 99% of common hardware), that crap was just a checkmark. It just had to be done. It didn't matter if it was seamless, or fast. It just had to be done to get it out the door.

Even day, you see the exact same thing happening with Internet of Things. Except here, "security" isn't even a checkbox! Default admin/password credentials! Open ports! Telnet server running! All that matters is the thing gets shipped. All that matters is "sales today".

And it'll keep being that way until Congress of USA, EU, Canada, etc, all start making real financial penalties for data breaches. The reason ANYONE takes health information seriously is solely because of the financial penalties that show up as "risk" to the bottom line. Nobody cares about your data until the dollar signs show up.

The same thing applies to buggy software, and security exploits in general.

The only people who can actually afford to care are people like Microsoft because they're not building a single product, but a platform, so it's important for people to never want to switch platforms away. And, AFAIK, everything Microsoft has done API after API, is trust 3rd parties less.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User-Mode_Driver_Framework

Vista onward (and backported to XP), drivers can (and should) use a userland driver which can't destroy the kernel.

Quote:

Standard device drivers can be difficult to write because they must handle a very wide range of system and device states, particularly in a multithreaded software environment. Badly written device drivers can cause severe damage to a system (e.g., BSoD and data corruption) since all standard drivers have high privileges when accessing the kernel directly. The User-Mode Driver Framework insulates the kernel from the problems of direct driver access, instead providing a new class of driver with a dedicated application programming interface at the user level of interrupts and memory management. If an error occurs, the new framework allows for an immediate driver restart without impacting the system. This is particularly useful for devices that are intermittently connected to the system or support hot swapping via a bus technology such as USB or Firewire.

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

Erin Maus
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

My advisor from my college forwarded me an internship opportunity from Epic Games, so I applied...

I hope having a good GPA and my current job (software developer @ a local software dev shop) helps out. This would be awesome--it's a full-time, paid internship.

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / she

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
avatar

Chris, I generally agree with you that it's how it is, but it's only like that because of a lack of competition and awareness. Obviously, if one mouse ships that doesn't work well because of bad drivers, and another mouse ships that works seemlessly, the seemless mouse will sell better if only people are made aware of it. Which admittedly back in the 90s and early 00s drivers were a mystical concept that few people understand, and yet it will still often a sort of manual process to get them installed. They didn't magically get installed by the OS or by plug-and-play. And people were even more illiterate than they are today. So yeah, the environment was there for vendors to not care. But certainly the Internet helps to spread the quality issues: if something doesn't just work and a competing product does then sales will definitely suffer in the last 10-15 years. That still didn't help Vista or 8 much. :P

Aaron, congrats and good luck! That sounds like a really awesome opportunity.

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

bamccaig said:

if only people are made aware of it.

That's what I mean. The free market doesn't exist. It only exists when buyers and sellers have an equal access to information.

Most people will buy a mouse whether the drivers suck or not as long as they don't suck horribly. And many won't even realize the mouse is blue-screening windows.

It's not even on the list of things to check off. So it doesn't get done.

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

Neil Roy
Member #2,229
April 2002
avatar

A new GoFundMe has started to get the American people to fund the wall if congress won't. In the first day it went up to over 1/4 million dollars. It is currently at over $7million in just 3 days. :o

https://www.gofundme.com/TheTrumpWall

---
“I love you too.” - last words of Wanda Roy

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

I would imagine many of those are fake donations. ...

Also, little shy of 5 billion...

Also Fun fact: Many legal Spanish-Americans actually support stronger immigration controls. "We got in legally, why shouldn't they have to?"

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

raynebc
Member #11,908
May 2010

It'd be interesting to see if it's ruled that the government will be allowed to accept private donations for defense/immigration spending. The Republicans seem to be too politically cowardly to make this wall a hard line issue, even after promising billions to other countries for THEIR border security.

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
avatar

Jesus, do you guys want to live behind another Iron Curtain?

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video

Quote :
Freedom and security go together.

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
avatar

Americans don't actually think the wall is a good thing, do they? ??? It's going to be very amusing when America turns to shit and there's a big expensive strong wall keeping them in! :D :D :D :D

Except they'll probably only build one on the Mexican border so that would make them our problem. :( :(

Fuck it, you guys need 2 walls! We let Mexicans in freely so if you want to truly keep them out you need a wall here too! ;D ;D ;D

I consider these kinds of ideas trolling. Trump is a master troll. Alas, there's nobody to call mainstream media a noob and tell them not to feed the trolls so the trolls just keep getting stronger...

Neil Roy
Member #2,229
April 2002
avatar

It's up to $10M now and how is it not a good thing to keep illegal criminals out? Legals are all welcome. The wall around Israel really helped. In some places they have an illegal immigration problem to the tune of 50000 getting in (for a nation that size that is huge). People complained about it when they first built it. Now that illegal immigration is down to zero, nobody is complaining. It works.

Just ask all the democrats that have walls around their homes.

Bad example Edgar, the wall around Germany was built to keep Germans IN, not to keep people from entering.

---
“I love you too.” - last words of Wanda Roy

bamccaig
Member #7,536
July 2006
avatar

These are man's laws, not "God's" laws (not as though I respect either, but you probably do). They are not divine. They are not perfect. And it's not even like the US has public health care or public funding for most things. Their taxes are dirt cheap and most states don't provide much assistance (and illegals wouldn't qualify anyway!). :P

In general, I don't think that things are "critical" where a wall is actually necessary. People fleeing from Mexico into the USA have basically no options. It can be argued that they take jobs from Americans, and that's probably something worth fighting. But it's really the employers in those circumstances that are cheating, not the Mexicans who are just trying to find a better life. Shouldn't the government target the employers instead of the desperate people?

Building a wall is only going to limit desperate people to abuses and violence (which I'm sure the US government has done its share to spark). And desperate people with nothing to live for are a lot more dangerous than hopeful people with a gamble of a chance. I don't think the wall is going to solve any problems. I think it's going to exacerbate things. And for a short time it might well cut down on illegal immigration, but it might also lead to much worse things down the line.

It's a stupid solution to a big problem. The real problem is that we draw lines in the map and refuse to work together. The world is changing. We're more connected than ever. We need these corrupt rich people structures to go fuck themselves and for all of us to work together to take care of us. A neighbour is a neighbour whether they're next to your house or next to your country. And if a neighbour needs help then you should help them. You never know when it'll be you, your children, or your grandchildren that need their neighbour's help instead.

Neil Roy
Member #2,229
April 2002
avatar

And yet, Obama, Hillary, Bill... were ALL in favour of tougher border security and a wall of some sort. Yet people didn't hate it until TRUMP became president. The news footage of all these people supporting tougher border security is on record. It works. NOBODY IS AGAINST LEGAL IMMIGRANTS. If they TRULY need help. Heck, Mexico already offered to help them but they refused it! Which tells you something.

As for the Bible... well, when New Jerusalem comes down out of heaven and Jesus rules out of it (here on Earth), it will have walls all around it. They are described in detail. Israel right now has walls and it has helped them tremendously.

If your neighbour needs help and asks you, absolutely you should help if you can. But what if your neighbour breaks into your home without your permission and steals what they want? That's the problem here!!! NOBODY is against helping their neighbour, we're against THIEVES breaking in and stealing what they want!

---
“I love you too.” - last words of Wanda Roy

Chris Katko
Member #1,881
January 2002
avatar

Jesus, do you guys want to live behind another Iron Curtain?

Careful. If you're responding to me, you're actually reacting to your emotions and not my actual content.

Also, you're misgendering the issue. ;) A wall along a country's border is NOT THE SAME as cutting a country of the SAME PEOPLE in half and subjecting half of them to communist torture. They had land mines along the Berlin Wall.

So to imply that a country merely wanting to regulate illegal immigration, to the Berlin Wall, might as well be the communist version of Godwin's Law.

Only in 2018, would people be so insane as to think a country doesn't have a right to regulate immigration. And I'd dare you to try sneaking into another country and seeing how well they treat you.

https://www.axios.com/canada-warns-illegal-immigrants-from-us-you-will-be-apprehended-ae00fed7-d78b-41aa-aad7-41bc27945983.html

"OMG, NAZI CANADA!"

p.s. Note I never actually said I support a wall.

-----sig:
“Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute.” - Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs
"Political Correctness is fascism disguised as manners" --George Carlin

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
avatar

Uh, shouldn't that be on http://gofundme.mx? What are all these Americans doing paying for the wall? Doesn't anybody remember what the Orange Prophet said? And now he's prepared to shut down the government and take all credit for it! Except for none of the credit ... "The Democrats now own the shutdown!"

The Berlin wall was effective because it was tiny and manned 24/7 by snipers. The Trump wall is the stupidest, most racist, fear-mongering waste of money the government has talked about spending in a long time.

Now if a bunch of rednecks want to, on their own accord, take their health insurance and grocery money and send it to Trump's cronies to have them line their pockets building a pointless wall that is bested by a shovel or ladder, then by all means please do. A fool and his money are soon parted.

Neil Roy
Member #2,229
April 2002
avatar

Matthew... protecting your nation from illegal immigrants is racist... how? LEGAL immigrants are welcome. You're a fucking idiot!

---
“I love you too.” - last words of Wanda Roy

raynebc
Member #11,908
May 2010

Don't you know? Any majority white country that wants to curtail illegal immigration and limit unskilled economic migrants is racist. Simple-minded people accept that sentiment wholeheartedly. After all, "orange man bad."

Erin Maus
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / she

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
avatar

Careful. If you're responding to me, you're actually reacting to your emotions and not my actual content.

Also, you're misgendering the issue. ;) A wall along a country's border is NOT THE SAME as cutting a country of the SAME PEOPLE in half and subjecting half of them to communist torture. They had land mines along the Berlin Wall.

...

"OMG, NAZI CANADA!"

p.s. Note I never actually said I support a wall.

I was responding to NiteHacker, as he's the one that brought it up.

Whether a wall is made to keep people certain people in, or certain people out is irrelevant. A wall separates people, that is its only purpose, whether it is for defense or whether it is because of xenophobia and ethnocentrism. (Yes, big words, chew thoroughly.)

I agree with everything bamccaig said in his post here.

NiteHackr said:

Bad example Edgar, the wall around Germany was built to keep Germans IN, not to keep people from entering.

And this wall is to keep Mexicans IN Mexico... what's the difference?

The Trump wall is the stupidest, most racist, fear-mongering waste of money the government has talked about spending in a long time.

QFT.

NiteHackr said:

Matthew... protecting your nation from illegal immigrants is racist... how? LEGAL immigrants are welcome. You're an idiot!

Watch your mouth.

The wall is not about border security. It's about keeping Mexicans out of the US. If LEGAL immigrants were welcome, then applying for work visas wouldn't be a problem. Asylum seekers wouldn't be turned away. People wouldn't have to sneak across the border unless they were doing something illegal and they didn't want to get caught.

Now if a bunch of rednecks want to, on their own accord, take their health insurance and grocery money and send it to Trump's cronies to have them line their pockets building a pointless wall that is bested by a shovel or ladder, then by all means please do. A fool and his money are soon parted.

Well said. Always nice to hear from you Fearless Leader.

Building a wall along the entire length of the US - Mexico border is a ridiculous idea. It would cost an idiotic amount of money. That money could be better spent on humanitarian aid in the form of infrastructure for a modern migrant workforce. Expand work and student visas. Give asylum seekers the chance they need to get away from violence. Fund low income housing.

It's just another distraction in Trump's game of sleight of hand. Keep people focused on a pointless wall that will never get funded to fuel their xenophobia.

As if all that wasn't enough, if we truly wanted border security, we would spend more money on monitoring the border electronically. Motion sensors, infrared cameras, satellites, etc... then they could be intercepted before they even got into the country.

Matthew Leverton
Supreme Loser
January 1999
avatar

Once Trump starts whining about building a wall on the northern border, then I might change my opinion that he is racist to simply a nationalistic hypocrite who imports his own wives and workers illegally but doesn't want anybody else to be able to afford to do so.

Similar to what Edgar is saying ... they are only illegal because we say they are. They are only unskilled because we do not train them. The problem is not the lack of a wall; the problem is a lack of planning for a compassionate, humane way to handle an influx of people who are fleeing bad situations.

Edgar Reynaldo
Major Reynaldo
May 2007
avatar

Matthew, the peasants are revolting!

EDIT SRSLY, we could use a 2 week time out on thread locks.

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In other news :

jmasterx said:

We have a thread that just opened recently regarding this very issue. It should be resolved shortly.
Check https://www.allegro.cc/forums/thread/615770 for updates

jmasterx is trying to kill me with laughter. >:( I pulled a muscle in my side today and every time I laugh or cough it hurts like hell. His response to the peasant revolt made me 101. ;D Ouch.

RIP :
dead_thread_list.push_back(Problems with Code::Blocks);
dead_thread_list.push_back(Ball Simulation);
dead_thread_list.push_back(Woe is me);
dead_thread_list.push_back(Cloning XP);

Erin Maus
Member #7,537
July 2006
avatar

My depot thread will soon become one with the locked threads. :(

Anyways here's Wonderwall.

video

---
ItsyRealm, a quirky 2D/3D RPG where you fight, skill, and explore in a medieval world with horrors unimaginable.
they / she



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